​

When did Yeshua say the dead in Christ would be resurrected?

When did Yeshua say He would return?

 

 

​

When did Jesus say the dead in Christ would be resurrected?

​

The First Resurrection regards the dead in Christ without Judgment which was also the meaning of the Cross by giving His blood as atonement for the sin of man. This I think cannot be hard to understand.

​

The Second is after 1000 years (?), but this time under great judgment. Left the goats and right the sheep.

​

Paul wrote that the Dead in Christ MUST rise FIRST, THEN we who are alive and remain will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air. This too I think cannot be hard to understand and means as it is written!

​

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17: 16 ...and the dead in Christ shall RISE FIRST. 17 THEN we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them...

In Rev. 20:4-5, John sees the souls of Saints who were BEHEADED for refusing the Mark of the Antichrist during the Great Tribulation. John writes that they will rise and reign with Christ for 1000 years and that this is the FIRST RESURRECTION!

​

If according to John, the beheaded rise (and all previous dead saints in history) at the FIRST resurrection and Paul said those who are alive and remain are not caught up until AFTER the dead in Christ are resurrected, then this means the so called catching up or rapture takes place AFTER tribulation and before the last and great disaster under the wrath of God upon the whole earth!

​

Tribulations are conflicts, troubles, bombs, local wars, Middle East (Islamic) conflicts among each other and blaming Israel for their own troubles and take Israel as usual into these conflicts. Tribulations are meant for Israel and her enemies the Islamic nations. Wrath instead is upon whole world. Wrath doesn’t contain any minor nor major tribulations, but unseen nature disasters and great war. This wrath is a long term punishment which could last several years, and which bible calls ‘the last great day or day of the Lord’, and includes the second coming combined with a previous resurrection of the dead first and then living saints before the Last great wrath of God as we can read in the sixth bowl and cross referenced by the seventh Trumpet where it’s all done.

​

Many twist both events, thinking that God's wrath is inclusive in the Tribulations. If bible refers to Noah's time about the great wrath upon earth and the end, then when was Noah saved? When was Lot saved? They both were saved just before the last devastating wrath and not many years previous to the event.

We 'pre last day wrath' (post trib) rapture believers do not claim we got it right, it’s scripture that does!

John 6:39-40: Jesus said, "This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up ON THE LAST DAY." !!!

John 6:44: Jesus said, "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up ON THE LAST DAY."

So if Jesus himself said the dead in Christ will be raised on the LAST DAY, and Paul said we who are alive and remain will not be caught up (raptured) until AFTER the dead are raised, then where does secret pre-trib rapture fit in?

​

1 Cor 15:52 - In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

We are changed at the LAST TRUMP and where is this found?

In REVELATION, the LAST BOOK of the Bible there are 7 trumps and the 7th trump is the LAST ONE and this is at the end of the tribulation and correspond with the sixth bowl, the seventh bowl the elect are gathered!

​

-----------------------------

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

​

When did Jesus say He would return?

​

2Tess 2:

1 "Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. 5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?"

​

It says: “neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us,” US who? Saints I suppose or maybe current people who are teaching gospel and others who try to explain the Rev 12 sign! But 'us' is definitely referring to the disciples in their lifetime, not present day!

Then we read: ''3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed,"

My note: Where do we see a falling away today when we regard the Rev 12 topic discussions and other biblical teachings we find on the internet and all around us? Nowhere! Where do we see the son of perdition who is supposed to arise in the Middle East and this before the second coming? The preparations are all going on in that part of the world, even in Israel, but still no man of perdition! Did scripture, in this case Yeshua, told us to watch only the heavenly signs? No, He told us to watch the signs of times around us. The Rev 12 sign is not a message of an instant revealing but a message of what is coming next into the world, as a clock, an alert, announcing that the end is not far away anymore and that those who are in true faith must be awake for they do not know when that liberation day comes!

​

Let us assume that rev 12 meant something different than what many are teaching now. Let's consider the child represents the Holy Spirit who will be taken away, and the red dragon being thrown on earth refers to the coming of the son of perdition, who current Middle East is waiting expectantly for his arrival and would refer to the false second coming as Yeshua told us, for this man will present himself as being the first Jesus who returns, and this is also according to Islamic eschatology, but however he, this false Christ will deceive many, especially Israel because he wil teach the islamic ideology saying that the first time he was on earth (referring to Yeshua’s first coming) people misunderstood his preachings about the Gospel while instead he preached islam? Wouldn’t you LOL when you read such things in islamic eschatology, I do, or better, I did, but this is how this endtime prophecy goes along on both sides! And it matches with the biblical endtimes revelations, but vice versa regarding the purpose of the characters.

Wouldn't this vision than rather match the current reality in the Middle East than rather what is taught about the rapture and Yeshua's second coming next September? Salvation and 2nd coming are definitely facts in the near future and with no doubt these will manifest, but not next September, because nothing assimilates: not current events nor scripture regarding the timeframe and evolutions of earthly endtime facts and events.

Let's be honest: would this vision possibly occur in the short timeframe of the next following 3 months? I think 3 months to reveal this all would be seriously very ‘very’ short according to how God in bible uses te term of 'time'.

​

------

​

Matt 24:23: “Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew (display) great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold, I have told you before.”

​

Yeshua didn’t say: the false prophet and his compagnions display great signs and wonders, but false Christs and false prophets all over the world! For we still live in a material world without any kind of natural visible sorcery nor hocus pocus regarding this matter, it can only refer to the real meaning of signs and wonders interpreted by scriputure ! Signs and wonders could probably refer to the signs in the heavens which were misinterpreted and then misrepresented by many christian teachers. But actually they didn’t misrepresented the signs in the context of what is written, but got it wrong in setting dates and the timeline seen from earthly events.

​

Thus, not only the man of perdition who will claim to be Jesus and deceive many is a false prophet, but apparently also those previous to his appearance who are preaching a false 2nd Coming/rapture, who then, after the delusion of a wrong set date, will also be set responsible for the great apostasy which will occur after the delusion when people state that actually nothing happened: delusions and a great apostasy will follow! What a failure! Who will believe them again next? They are really putting a lot of effort on it. What happened in september 1988, when was prophecied that on the feast of Trumpet of that september 1988 rapture would occur! Delusion and a great falling away were the consequences. People who believed this sold their homes, possessions ect ...! Will this happen again in september 2017? I hope for all these teachers and saints that their vision may be revealed, for i long to be soon with our Lord, but according what scripture says I sligthly fear for a delusion.

​

Matt24: 26 “Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. “ This is the sign of His coming!

​

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: After tribulations the wrath begins! 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

​

I think that the New Testament is clear enough about the timing of the second coming, and therefore one doesn’t need any other passage from the Old Testament to confirm this!

Note: i’m not judging anyone, for we all are in Christ and love Him that much that we took scripture inside out to discover when we possibly are going to meet Him. I do not criticize for i do not know if pre trib saints got it right, and besides, i do not know if i and many others got it right, for with God everything is possible, and it’s only a matter of ‘always being ready for that day no one knows when it comes’!

However it doesn’t matter when rapture occurs, this date or that date, as long as we all remain awake and ready to rejoice His second coming, and we would be much more exited being surprised by His coming, then if we would have known a date!

​

Let us see it this way:

1 -When you do not know a date it would be like: “Look, what’s that... that light there above? Oh my... He is COMING! I’ve never seen such li... ! ” Meanwhile tears will touch your smile... and then at once complete silence, for you couldn’t even finish your sentence and were caught up!

​

2-When you know and expect a set date and half the world with you, it would be like: “Where is He, it’s already 10 PM!” Nervosity, anger, fear, distress is surrounding your mind, your heart is bouncing as it would almost shut your breath. “Oh, Maybe tomorrow... or tomorrow after tomorrow... or did we set wrong the year!” But after a week He still didn’t show up, neither did He after the end of that year... and then complete silence... for a long time!

​

Which of both scenario’s would you chose?

I chose the first!

​

At the end i’ll give a good advice: no one has to take this at heart if he doesn’t want to, but i’ll give it anyway: there’s a saying that says:

A wise man follows his own vision, an ignorant man follows public opinion!

​

if you want a personal vision then read bible with all of your heart, mind and spirit. If your heart says that your understandings are as it is written with the blessings of the Holy Spirit, then you can be sure you got it right. But do not listen to many differant visions other then yours, because then you will be confused and start to doubt your own vision, and then finally when only doubt remains, you’ll chose and accept the opinion of the majority and the majority in most cases believe a lie, for a lie still is a lie, even if the majority belief it. The truth instead will be always the truth even if no one believes it. When doubt overcomes you, examine always first by yourself and then check what others say about it, but if your own understanding is too differant then many others, then be sure you got it right!

​

Be wise and follow Yeshua, not the world!

Amen!

​

Blessings to all of you !

​

TNC

​

​